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Author Topic : Male Model Forum 
The_Commandante

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City: London (Earls Court)
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Member Since: May 18, 2005
Posts: 654
Views : 4746  Aug 26, 2009 7:38am

I've noticed recently that there has been a big increase in the number of male models joining. This is fantastic! When I think back a year or two, it was pretty much Gand and I sat on our own beckoning from the sidelines!

There are also more photographers specialising in shooting males ... Marcus, Miss Fatale, KK1 to name a few.

And yes, before you mention it, there are also a lot more todgers!!!

So, I think the time has come to renew my campaign calling for a Male Model Forum, dedicated specifically to male models trying to promote themselves and to photoraphers looking for males to feature in their shots.

What do people think?


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Zenith

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Posts: 4928
RE: Male Model Forum Aug 26, 2009 8:27am

This is a must for the site - it's been a long time coming. There are so many male models out there who are not getting the recognition they deserve in their own right.



Re-locating to Nottingham in September!

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The_Commandante

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RE: Male Model Forum Aug 26, 2009 9:45am

I have certainly suggested it before, but there were far fewer of us then.

I will volunteer to moderate it with Flickity-tickity if needed.


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SimonL

Photographer
City: Dubai
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Member Since: Aug 4, 2005
Posts: 6935
RE: Male Model Forum Aug 26, 2009 10:04am

quoting post from Zenith:

This is a must for the site - it's been a long time coming. There are so many male models out there who are not getting the recognition they deserve in their own right.



Re-locating to Nottingham in September!


Actually - I wholeheartedly disagree.

I don't see a female models forum.

Why?

Because there isn't the need for one. Its perfectly plausable to argue that there are many female models that aren't getting the recognition they deserve too. Why don't they have their own forum?
Should we give a forum to trans-gendered models as they're a minority group too? Why shouldn't GWC's and crap photographers therefore have a special place to bitch?

Where do we stop?

The male models that are getting the recognition are the ones that have adapted themselves to the niche in which they wish to work and have developed the skills to promote themselves effectively with a high quality portfolio in a difficult market - just like photographers have to.

Whilst it could be argued that, as a photographer that has specialised in the male form on this site before many others and this could be to my benefit - I don't feel that it would actually benefit anyone.

One very strong 'Disagree' here.

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The_Commandante

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City: London (Earls Court)
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Posts: 654
RE: Male Model Forum Aug 26, 2009 10:42am

Well, I think its fair to say that 90%+ of the stuff on most forums is for female models, so they do in effect have their own area and certainly would if the males had one too.

I think there is a case to be made for the addition of forums for something like 'Alternative Models' as this is also slightly more niche.

Its not about preferential treatment, its about ease of use and of access. Its no different to having forums differentiated by location or by tpe of payment. Photographers that specifically need a male can advertise on there and males can specifically look on there rather than being led down the garden path by the adverts just asking for "a model" when actually they mean "a female model".


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SimonL

Photographer
City: Dubai
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Member Since: Aug 4, 2005
Posts: 6935
RE: Male Model Forum Aug 26, 2009 1:08pm

quoting post from The_Commandante:

Well, I think its fair to say that 90%+ of the stuff on most forums is for female models, so they do in effect have their own area and certainly would if the males had one too.


Again - the females are simply using the forums as they exist and should be used.

There is no benefit to the site as a whole by the addition of extra forums to use up extra bandwidth.

I refer back to my previous statement that the males need to make more of a presence and learn to market themselves more effectively.

I never mentioned the word 'preferential'.

The tools for models already exist within the current site layout and framework. Adding extra forums is actually more likely to detract from ease of use and access.

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JD_Rose

Model
City: Nottingham
Country: United Kingdom
Member Since: Jun 24, 2005
Posts: 7322
RE: Male Model Forum Aug 26, 2009 1:12pm

I for one think it would be a good idea to have the male model forums going,

Give the guys a chance and as there are a lot more women than malesthe women dont really need one,

At the same time i would have to say the male model forum wouldnt really be needed,

As theones that are active like me and BBB people know of as we are there a lot,

I think it would be a good idea but at the same time it aint needed to badly as guys can still shine without it,

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SimonL

Photographer
City: Dubai
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Posts: 6935
RE: Male Model Forum Aug 26, 2009 1:18pm

quoting post from JD_Rose:

As the ones that are active like me and BBB people know of as we are there a lot,

I think it would be a good idea but at the same time it aint needed to badly as guys can still shine without it,


Exactly.

You're using the tools provided to do the job and they do it perfectly well.

QED..

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SpitFire_Punk

Model
City: Ashford
Country: United Kingdom
Member Since: Mar 5, 2007
Posts: 899
RE: Male Model Forum Aug 26, 2009 1:20pm

Yeah i certainly like this idea

However, i can see what Simon means, and to be fair, i cant imagine it would ever be that busy.... just how often are us guys in demand?

Though like many other guys, I have spent hours going through forum posts looking for suitable work..... but I rarley do this anymore and spend more time as a general forum whore on off-topic posts as i can get work easier from those

EDIT - Also as stated by James & Simon.... it also shows which male mods actually work at marketing themselves and building a professional portfolio and good references etc......

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KK1

Photographer
City: Milton Keynes
Country: United Kingdom
Member Since: Jun 8, 2008
Posts: 4358
RE: Male Model Forum Aug 26, 2009 1:28pm


In fairness, and I've only been here a year, I can list on one hand the regularly active male models on the forums. This kind of beggars the question, why? Do they not want to join in, do not have the time, aren't really interested, get overlooked as they are in the minority or just don't know what sort of reception they will get?

I did try and champion the Male Model thread for a while. OK it got a bit silly with the perving and all, but shot a few guys off the back of it, some who have since disappeared.

I agree with Simon, more effort could be made in the self-promotion area (not aimed at the OP), but fail to see how a Male Model Forum will make a difference. I like being proved wrong though. Just my humble opinion.

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JD_Rose

Model
City: Nottingham
Country: United Kingdom
Member Since: Jun 24, 2005
Posts: 7322
RE: Male Model Forum Aug 26, 2009 1:28pm

quoting post from SpitFire_Punk:

Yeah i certainly like this idea

However, i can see what Simon means, and to be fair, i cant imagine it would ever be that busy.... just how often are us guys in demand?

Though like many other guys, I have spent hours going through forum posts looking for suitable work..... but I rarley do this anymore and spend more time as a general forum whore on off-topic posts as i can get work easier from those

EDIT - Also as stated by James & Simon.... it also shows which male mods actually work at marketing themselves and building a professional portfolio and good references etc......


Exactly,

A lot of males on here aint to active to be honest, There are alot more on here nowadays but a lot aint that active so the male model thread would be quiet still,

As simon said though by being active on other threads as well people know we are there if we are wanted as we are so active so everyone knows our names,

I mean it could be useful for quieter members but if they are quiet then the threads would be too,

It aint too bad an idea though and could be quite busy and may tempt quieter males to be a little more active

Who knows??

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JD_Rose

Model
City: Nottingham
Country: United Kingdom
Member Since: Jun 24, 2005
Posts: 7322
RE: Male Model Forum Aug 26, 2009 1:33pm

At one point as well i did a suggestions forum i nhelp of males as well,

I suggested that so the Male models know who to get in touch with as a lot of photographers dont work with males why dont they add a few boxes on the photographer page which staes

work with males
work with females
work with under 18's

Tick the ones they are willing to work with so gives all idaes who they could contact for a shoot or whatever,

That never took off either sadly,

Would eb good to have something though to help male models a little

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SimonL

Photographer
City: Dubai
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Member Since: Aug 4, 2005
Posts: 6935
RE: Male Model Forum Aug 26, 2009 1:34pm

quoting post from JD_Rose:

It aint too bad an idea though and could be quite busy and may tempt quieter males to be a little more active

Who knows??


Shouldn't they just become more active on the existing forums?



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JD_Rose

Model
City: Nottingham
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Member Since: Jun 24, 2005
Posts: 7322
RE: Male Model Forum Aug 26, 2009 1:39pm

quoting post from SimonL:

Shouldn't they just become more active on the existing forums?



Well i would say so yeah,

I dont see why not, and they would still be seen and noticed as well,


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The_Commandante

Thread Starter / Model
City: London (Earls Court)
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Member Since: May 18, 2005
Posts: 654
RE: Male Model Forum Aug 26, 2009 1:45pm

Precisely. There is a forum catered to this particular area.

I honestly think that a lot of males would get scared off because they see this site as primarily female orientated. Not everyone knows how to market themselves correctly at first. A lot of girls only get started by someone spotting their first pics pop up.

Also, a lot of ads for male models get knocked off the front page by people talking about selling a pair of shoes or whatever. It would be nice to know there was somewhere to go that you knew catered for what you wanted.


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SimonL

Photographer
City: Dubai
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Posts: 6935
RE: Male Model Forum Aug 26, 2009 1:57pm

quoting post from The_Commandante:

It would be nice to know there was somewhere to go that you knew catered for what you wanted.



There is.

However - you may have to broaden your horizons to it.

When I joined the site - I was the only photographer that clearly specialised in male physique photography. Other photographers photographed male models, but largely as an aside or to accompany female models.

I quickly realised that this was never going to be a sustainable source of quality male models for my work, either paid, commisioned, TFP or whatever. One loook into my portfolio will tell you how many models I use from this site.

As male models you are in a minority - therefore it is even more important to get into the mainstream of the site and not condemn yourselves to a minority forum where few photographers are likely to venture - thats a suicidal move.

Your suggestion may, on the face of it seem like a good idea, but from a business viewpoint, its a very, very bad move.

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JD_Rose

Model
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Posts: 7322
RE: Male Model Forum Aug 26, 2009 2:06pm

quoting post from SimonL:

There is.

However - you may have to broaden your horizons to it.

When I joined the site - I was the only photographer that clearly specialised in male physique photography. Other photographers photographed male models, but largely as an aside or to accompany female models.

I quickly realised that this was never going to be a sustainable source of quality male models for my work, either paid, commisioned, TFP or whatever. One loook into my portfolio will tell you how many models I use from this site.

As male models you are in a minority - therefore it is even more important to get into the mainstream of the site and not condemn yourselves to a minority forum where few photographers are likely to venture - thats a suicidal move.

Your suggestion may, on the face of it seem like a good idea, but from a business viewpoint, its a very, very bad move.


Have to agree,

It may give them time to shine but at the same time it closes off being out there as much as possible on other threads as well,

The same time if someone needed a male modfel they would know where to look but atthe same time could also just do a search for the male model really,

Have to agree with simon on this
Sorry

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SimonL

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RE: Male Model Forum Aug 26, 2009 2:06pm

You've both answered the question and effectively argued against your own forum.

This site is predominantly female orientated - you're not going to change that with addition of a minority forum to pidgeon hole male models further still.. you'll make the situation worse.


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The_Commandante

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City: London (Earls Court)
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Posts: 654
RE: Male Model Forum Aug 26, 2009 2:25pm

quoting post from SimonL:

As male models you are in a minority - therefore it is even more important to get into the mainstream of the site and not condemn yourselves to a minority forum where few photographers are likely to venture - thats a suicidal move.

Your suggestion may, on the face of it seem like a good idea, but from a business viewpoint, its a very, very bad move.


I don't think so. Clearly I am active in the forums and get involved in discussions regarding a whole variety of things, not just raising my hand when a work opportunity comes along. I don't think it would prevent people from being active elsewhere, but I think it would encourage them to stay on the site long enough to get involved.


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SimonL

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RE: Male Model Forum Aug 26, 2009 2:40pm

quoting post from The_Commandante:

I don't think so. Clearly I am active in the forums and get involved in discussions regarding a whole variety of things, not just raising my hand when a work opportunity comes along. I don't think it would prevent people from being active elsewhere, but I think it would encourage them to stay on the site long enough to get involved.


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Those that want to get involved, will get involved.

Those that don't, wont.

The addition of this extra forum will not bring one single benefit to the site.

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KK1

Photographer
City: Milton Keynes
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Posts: 4358
RE: Male Model Forum Aug 26, 2009 2:51pm


Simon has a point Rick. I was looking at how many male models were logged on whilst this has been on the front page. There were 4 or 5 and surely they must have read this. Not one of them came forward and contributed. An ideal opportunity to have a say I would have thought.

Anyway I'm quietish next week if you want to shoot with me !
I have no ideas, but if you have we could have a bash

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UK_Cardiff_Photographer

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Posts: 239
RE: Male Model Forum Aug 26, 2009 8:14pm

quoting post from SimonL:

When I joined the site - I was the only photographer that clearly specialised in male physique photography. Other photographers photographed male models, but largely as an aside or to accompany female models.

I quickly realised that this was never going to be a sustainable source of quality male models for my work, either paid, commisioned, TFP or whatever. One look into my portfolio will tell you how many models I use from this site.


Actually, I was already here when you joined ... I too specialise in male photography.

I too have to use several other model sites and I also use agencies as a contact point ... and I now happen to use models from here less and less. That's simply because there are more active models and in the style/type of model I use on other sites.

Male models who are really serious about promoting themselves MUST be more active (those who actually do that on here are, sadly, fairly small in number). Personally, it's annoying for me when casting for an assignment and I find a model who looks "just right" but hasn't logged in for two months. On these type of modelling sites, I need to be sure that the model will at least read my offer ... and hopefully respond ... well before I need to book a model. Now I will not contact a model unless I have seen some regular activity from him.

If male models are serious about promoting themselves then they should also be on at least two other "well used" model sites ... and routinely log in each day to each site to build some activity. I simply suggest that this might yield better dividends ... and be a wiser use of their time than having a specialised male forum on this particular site.

A male forum might well be helpful for models to exchange ideas etc ... but I don't believe it would necessarily bring you any more work ... it would not attract the photographers you seek.




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SimonL

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Posts: 6935
RE: Male Model Forum Aug 27, 2009 3:46am

quoting post from UK_Cardiff_Photographer:

Actually, I was already here when you joined ... I too specialise in male photography.

Male models who are really serious about promoting themselves MUST be more active (those who actually do that on here are, sadly, fairly small in number). Personally, it's annoying for me when casting for an assignment and I find a model who looks "just right" but hasn't logged in for two months. On these type of modelling sites, I need to be sure that the model will at least read my offer ... and hopefully respond ... well before I need to book a model. Now I will not contact a model unless I have seen some regular activity from him.

If male models are serious about promoting themselves then they should also be on at least two other "well used" model sites ... and routinely log in each day to each site to build some activity. I simply suggest that this might yield better dividends ... and be a wiser use of their time than having a specialised male forum on this particular site.

A male forum might well be helpful for models to exchange ideas etc ... but I don't believe it would necessarily bring you any more work ... it would not attract the photographers you seek.




You're right, you were - I do apologise..I'm guessing that Connex was here too, although he is rarely now.

I am glad that you agree with my previous observations on the subject though.. nothing will beat effective self-promotional techniques..



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RedRaynes

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Posts: 485
RE: Male Model Forum Aug 27, 2009 4:40am

surely if it was used as a starting point then it might not be a bad idea? People use it but dont just live there.

My other thought was what about photographers who don't really use the forums. It could be a good place for them to go if they just decide to try them looking for someone.

But then again, that could only be a small percentage so probably still not worth it.

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jamesallan

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Posts: 131
RE: Male Model Forum Aug 27, 2009 4:53am

i concur


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